In the case of this particular apparition, no legitimate investigation was ever done. Anyone who goes to HLM is not disobedient. Joan of Arc was condemned by bishops who told her to renounce her visions. Guess who turnd out to be right in the end? If you enjoyed this article, subscribe to receive more great content just like it. If the bishop says dont, have enough respect for him to obey. He can warn and that is what he has done. So the issue is obedience to the Bishop. Rather than allow such disappointment to derail them, they can instead take a big step closer to God. You cannot and you ignore that question too. And, thank you, denis. There are abuses of power and authority. St. Padre Pio was a priest. Would Jesus and His Blessed Mother and the saints choose Sweeney-Kyle to give the Catholic Church a tongue-lashing? Sometimes you just might be surprised on what your heart will tell you and what may or may not be false. Satans work! Ill take the apparitions, thank you. Defense of Holy Love Ministries is defense of the Catholic Faith. Dont you see what hes accomplishing? This justifies and verifies the goodness of the place in his mind. 2. The above is more about emotions and passions run amock than the practicing of Divine/Catholic Faith (to say nothing of Reason). There are none. (1) Our Lady does not need our prayers. We try to live holy lives and follow Gods Will. First of all, the Bishop of the diocese in which HLM is, has been unable to CONDEMN HLM because there is no heresy being promulgated there.. Condemnation would be a canonical act and it is not warranted because there is no heresy being preached there. Remember what Joan of Arc went through with bishops. Lord have mercy. God never violates our free will, as He wants our liberty to be intact, and it gives Him so much glory when we DO CHOOSE (through our free will) to accept His grace and allow it to flow into our soul. If we do not take the word of our bishop, we are in trouble. if u believe whats going on in the middle east and especially the holy land is all about democracy, then i believe we are operating under and are in the age of THE OPERATION OF ERROR of the end of the age. Or Jesus and Mary incessantly talk about U.S. politics, politicians, who to vote for, applauding various election outcomes. These are the pearls that are consistently in evidence at this apparition site. Given that he himself may have an all-too human agenda for nixing HLM, and add to that he will not give a reason for his disapproval, and add to that the corruption that now infiltrates the Catholic Church, I am very wary of him. After the above comes specific rulings in 4 parts (conveniently numbered): 1) Lennon declares Sweeney-Kyles claims to be not supernatural in origin. Dont be surprised if you hear that someday, will you? Can you say that of many bishops now in this country? Again, I present the Decree for all to read: No other citations are necessary. I had been warned by Thomas and a couple ofothers (friends of his, Im guessing), that souls are at stake should my words turn people away from Holy Love. against abortion.". If someone has come to this point, has no internal red flags upon hearing any of these messages, it follows that they wouldnt care what the Bishop has to say. Thank you. Your final 2 sentences sent a chill up my spine. Again, Bishop Lennon does not have canonical authority to condemn something if there is no matter of condemnation. One of my former theology professors at Notre Dame also endorses the messages. I have an interesting story about another alleged apparition site: Conyers, GA I went to Conyers quite innocently; more or less a tag-a-long with my wife and her sister and mom. Its not wrong to go to a site where purported apparitions are occurring. You are here: Home Featured Apparitions at Holy Love Ministries Revisited. Your argument, 3221, only proves the ecumenical ministry claim is a ploy to get out from under the legitimate authority of the local Ordinary and the Holy See. Are You Living in Condemnation? 4 Warning Signs That Something's Just I keep asking people, What will you do when the Pope (not this one, of course) tells you that the Holy Eucharist is only the living God during the Mass, so please put the remaining hosts in the garbage. Then we had better know the difference between true obedience and the false obedience of excess. I had heard of this before. If he would be transparent on his reasons I would support him 100%. @LizEst I could not go on the link to join the book club it doesnt work. There is a saying that I think applies to your situation and please know it saddens me to say this, but say it I will: Never argue with an idiot. My loyalty and obedience is to God first. Thanks be to God ~ the Most Holy Trinity and Mother Mary Most Holy! Where Charity abidith there is Love let our Love for one another be as strong as our love of self! Read the Decree here: http://www.dioceseofcleveland.org/news/2009/Holy%20Love%20-%20Decree%20in%20English%20-%202009-11-11.pdf. You wont be asking that question. I am so sorry that I so disturb your peace. Been there. You are naive if you think it is loyalty to the Church to obey directives blindly from bishops who clearly are in defiance of Rome. 38 Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Do you still believe as the authorities thought they did, that Joans voices were from the devil? Your condescending mockery of what is helping others is not appreciated and does not smack of a graced response. James McManus had some words about this phenomenon amongst traditionalists. May I suggest him to all interested parties? I guess you have never heard of Joan of Arc, who was condemned by the Chuch authorities. This is a New Era in time, and it is all due to Holy Love. You have the document that proves condemnation. Mary is entirely correct. I lost my father to this place simply because the visionary and other devoted followers made him feel special and important. Her latest books areHoly Hacks: Everyday Ways to Live Your Faith & Get to HeavenandBig Hearted: Inspiring Stories from Everyday Families. We pray at HOLY LOVE. I have seen it myself and I know for a fact that her friends put in the piping for the water to draw people there. He may hate the rosary but he loves people rejecting Catholic Church authority which is what he is getting out of this deal. I just got those beads myself. This morning I was reading about the first Marian apparition in the U.S. approved by the Church. Seven Hills, Oh. I am obedient to God first and am fully aware of being discerning. And by setting themselves against His church, visionaries and their followers who knowingly disobey a authoritative and binding judgement of their Bishop willfully separate themselves from the Catholic church. But it is NOT coming from God. The Bishop of a diocese is not the last word on any apparition. But until then, we just have to be patient. An admonition is not a dictate., 3221 believes that the Blessed Virgin Mary told them all on 11/18/09 (after Bishop Lennons Decree): In the case of this particular apparition, no legitimate investigation was ever done. 3221 is a goner and is a member of the Holy Love Church. However, its my understanding that St. Joan refused to lie by saying that she was not hearing voices. Makes it look like it is genuine itself. Tell me, is this good and normal? Well worth the read. Amen." By traditional theology, that very statement constitutes the condemnation spoken of by Mrs. Armstrong in her letter. of the Church. There is absolutely no reason to invest yourself in questionable devotions. Yes, they will say,We are being persecuted till the end. I would have loved to have witnessed something like the pilgrims at Fatima did, but really, I do not need it. Come on folks. Thanks, LizEst. This tells me the depth of your discernment if you see the piece that Kevin cited as worthwhile. Be VERY alert. Did she have one?That is the only way, plus obedience to the Church . The Bishops decree against the Jesus said to test the spirits, but not all are bad. But, alas, Im not a writer. Nothing can stop Gods Spirit. One also needs to consider we can ot believe all the higher ups in the church anymorethe devil has infiltrated it. The "Rosary of the Unborn" Controversy - Pro-Life Action League 8/9/93 from Our Lady: There is no peace, save in the grace of My Heart. This is contrary to our faith. In combination with Marys heart that would make ten chambers. The problem is that I get the point only too well. If he refuses to listen even to the church, then treat him as you would a Gentile or a tax collector. People are hungry for God. Described her to me then was announced the message and what she was wearing. Many bishops DO APPROVE and are actually involved in HLM. Being part of a sea of people, all praying the rosary and loving God and His mother, is uplifting to say the least. Yes (not likely, but I am speaking theoretically here.) If people were inspired or received what they believe to be miracles at this site, then praise be to God! Translation: I like to practiceits also an avenue for those who cannot understand the English well. But when he comes, the Spirit of truth, he will guide you to all truth (John 16:12-13). On the contrary, my statement was quite loaded with theological references. I just saw that and fixed it but will repost here for you. We are free to heed it or not heed it, as it is not a formal canonical command to obedience. I call upon every poster (and future ones as well) to ignore 3221. St. Catherine of Sienna? IF A MYSTIC-VISIONARY IS DISOBEDIENT TO THE LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY IN THE CHURCH (ie- local Bishop, but also in the case of a professed religious, this could be their abbott, mother superior, provencial etc) -IF A ALLEGED VISIONARY IS DISOBEDIENT TO THE LOCAL BISHOP, THEN YOU CAN BE SURE THAT SUCH A PERSON IS NOT AUTHENTIC. In November of 2006, I wrote an article exposing the Holy Love site (reproduced below). I am sure he knew that. My earliest memory is being on the site and looking at pictures of the sky taken on the property, trying to discover what clouds or images that could be miraculous. recently Pope Benedict XV1 applied pressure to the Bishops when he stated that no monies should be given to organizations not in line with Church teachings. How dare you and shame on you! I do not need to. Can you repost the link? Perhaps you need a rest from this discussion. According to the knowledge, competence, and prestige which they possess, they have the right and even at times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful, without prejudice to the integrity of faith and morals, with reverence toward their pastors, and attentive to common advantage and the dignity of persons. The one who listens to you listens to me and the one who rejects you rejects me; and he who rejects me, rejects the one who sent me,Luke 10:16. Blind obedience is for slaves not for thinking people. Dont get caught up in the politics. Cover me with the Precious Blood of Your Divine Son. I pray that you believe in Holy Love sooner than later. His rhetoric is very specific and unique; it is easy to recognize. Ive never been there; no reason to. It all seems very clear to me. Elizabeth thinks HLM is a Church, thereby giving evidence of her complete ignorance of the interior life of grace. The bishop has an obligation to pastor his people and protect and nourish their faith. If the bishop told you that the Holy Eucharist is only the Body and Blood of Jesus DURING Mass, would you believe and follow that? 3221, have you actually studied the Churchs theology of private revelation? The Bishops decree against the so-called apparitions at Bayside (Vernoica Leuken) never uses the word condemned. It says no credibility can be given. The Journal reported that Kyle responded to Lennons decree by stating: We at Holy Love ministries are, and always have been, an ecumenical ministry. At Holy Love Ministries, it is reported that Jesus sometimes comes with Mary during her apparitions. Your interpretations of HLM messages are very confused and you exhibit grave misunderstandings of Catholic theology. But I suspect that if the Bishop had used whatever wording this person thinks are proper for a condemnation, s/he still would refuse to obey him because. God the Father is spirit and God the Holy Spirit is spirit. At the time of the apparition my daughter saw the Blessed Mother herself. and offer these thoughts. Perhaps his use of the phrase admonish the faithful to cease gathering for any religious, liturgical, spiritual or devotional purposes suggests something otherwise to you? Remember those who walked away from Christ because He told them,; Unless you eat the Flesh of the Son of God, you have no life in you. this was a hard saying for them. She asks for her loyal sons and daughters to pray the Rosary so that the sufferings of those in purgatory may be mitigated and that they may speedily be brought to Heaven. Patti Maguire Armstrong: The Stumbling Block of False Apparitions Then, it becomes a matter of obeying Catholic authority or thinking you know better. This is so sad that people run after these private revelations that bring some notoriety to a person in need, while the Fatima message is no longer preached. Initially, not all were ready to condemn Marino. he knows the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the church so its easier for man not to go to church..or where the true spirit of god is calling us back to true worship. In addition, there are a number of followers in the area where I live who were irritated by my observations. Christ was a man [human] like us in all things but sin. I must disagree with Thomas in this case as souls are at least equally at stake should people follow a false apparition. My point was that 3221 is throwing things out as fact, without confirming and verifying such. People, please do the research. Consider the options the devil has available to trap faithful Catholics? Now the whole purpose of going to HLM is predicated upon the belief the claims come from God. Holy Love Ministry Messages by Topic. 4) An HLM organization may not use the name Catholic and is not approved by Lennon. Elizabeth, Our Blessed Mother at HLM had every right to do what she did. Mary you are so mixed up. A six-chambered heart is not an apt metaphor for the heart of God. Who is to be obedient in this case? Does he support homosexual groups? May they rest in peace. The argument is as follows: Bishop Lennon only admonishes the faithful from going to HLM. Youre welcome! At that point, Holy Love Ministries took an ecumenical approach. Needless to say, he backed down.). Are the Holy Love messages necessary for salvation? While I was walking on the property not long ago I asked a priest from Nigera why so many priests from around the world are coming here. I am in no way affiliated with it. Do you have information or thoughts about the apparitions that supposedly occur at the site in Alabama? Thank youand God bless you and yours Elizabeth, and all readers here, with a Blessed Advent and Christmas season, as well. My life is stressful enough without stirring up such pots, I reasoned. You will be chastised by friends and family for being so true to the faith. Unfortunately, they do for that fakery-or demonic trickery- in a small Bosnian village). Evidently there is fuller need to elaborate further, Kevin. And, furthermore, this directly contradicts the 7/29/93 message above from Our Lady! Mother Teresa replied that, if their kneeling was a problem, they would leave the diocese. What was that you said earlier about leaving ones interior life to themselves and God, 3221?